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# 00:02:30 bhundven hello, mingwandroid
# 00:02:45 mingwandroid bhundven: hi, long time (again!)
# 00:02:59 mingwandroid .. ish. we'll say too long anyway.
# 00:04:51 bhundven heh
# 00:05:23 bhundven is stuck in a world where everyone wants peer review, but no one wants to do the actual peer review... *sigh*
# 00:05:38 mingwandroid work stuff or crosstool?
# 00:05:53 bhundven well, currently, crosstool-ng is work stuff
# 00:06:04 bhundven if I only got paid for it...
# 00:07:05 bhundven I'm actually also trying to resurrect an older board from the scrapyard in u-boot.
# 00:07:37 bhundven here nor there, ultimately, I need review finished on custom locations. the last three commits.
# 00:07:48 bhundven #288
# 00:08:28 bhundven y_morin got the first many commits reviewed, and then disappeared.
# 00:09:38 mingwandroid ok
# 00:09:45 bhundven mingwandroid: I also need to collaborate with you on 2-pass gcc
# 00:09:52 mingwandroid sure.
# 00:09:56 bhundven it seems more complex then I originally scoped.
# 00:10:14 mingwandroid can you merge my cygwin one just to get it off my plate? it's all good.
# 00:10:21 bhundven printed 100-gcc.sh, 8pt font, 10 pages...
# 00:10:28 mingwandroid yuck
# 00:10:32 bhundven hehe
# 00:10:50 bhundven yea, I have to look through it.
# 00:11:21 mingwandroid I removed the mingw-w64 part as it was just a "while I have your attention in the GCC plugins area" thing ..
# 00:11:36 bhundven yea
# 00:11:39 mingwandroid never intended for merging, as I said on first request.
# 00:11:40 bhundven I saw that.
# 00:11:45 bhundven :)
# 00:12:12 mingwandroid but I now stand by the request FWIW :-)
# 00:12:15 mingwandroid so .. how are you for availability over the upcoming holiday season?
# 00:12:57 bhundven I'm probably not going to get back to crosstool-ng until monday or so. Star Wars tomorrow... daughter saturday, sunday (american football)...
# 00:13:50 bhundven today I'm distracted with other things.
# 00:15:57 mingwandroid bhundven: sure np. I'm on MSYS2 today, tomorrow is shopping
# 00:16:15 mingwandroid bhundven: I'll try to clear some time on Monday for it.
# 00:16:25 bhundven cool.
# 00:17:21 mingwandroid so far, has anything been done for 2 pass or not?
# 00:17:22 bhundven my holidays this year are pretty meager. pretty much staying at home, keeping distracted with u-boot and ct-ng.
# 00:17:51 bhundven mingwandroid: I started to research stuff that still needs to be reworked after removing >= gcc-4.7.x
# 00:18:26 bhundven but there are 4 targets: core1, core2, gcc_host, and gcc_build
# 00:18:49 bhundven I'd like to merge the two backend functions into one backend function that can build all four.
# 00:19:06 bhundven there is so much code duplication between the two functions
# 00:19:28 bhundven the tricky part is, bare metal only needs one pass.
# 00:19:37 mingwandroid ok ..
# 00:19:52 bhundven cross-canadian is something I'm not sure of
# 00:20:27 mingwandroid cross canadian is running crosstool-ng in its entirity twice surely?
# 00:20:32 bhundven I'm not even looking at jpf's cross-native or native yet.
# 00:21:24 bhundven mingwandroid: well, I was under the impression that: you needed a cross compiler for build -> host and host -> target, before you build the cross canadian?
# 00:21:40 bhundven I could be wrong
# 00:21:49 bhundven I never had the need for a cross-canadian
# 00:23:49 mingwandroid AGAIK build -> target is the one that's needed to build the complex libraries (glibc etc)
# 00:23:52 mingwandroid AFAIK *
# 00:24:27 mingwandroid GCC itself will handle the canadian-ness for the rest internally, but it's been ages for me too.
# 00:25:04 bhundven so here is what I'm thinking
# 00:25:13 bhundven I go forward and merge the two backends
# 00:25:40 bhundven and, not intentionally, break cross-canadian
# 00:26:06 bhundven then we'll "take a second pass" on checking bare-metal and cross-canadian after the break
# 00:26:26 bhundven makes a recursive joke
# 00:26:45 mingwandroid we have examples of being able to build canadian cross compilers recently already:
# 00:27:00 bhundven one is broken, afaict
# 00:27:10 mingwandroid cygwin build -> mingw-w64 build -> linux target.
# 00:27:32 mingwandroid using cygwin's mingw-w64 cross compilers.
# 00:27:45 mingwandroid so that's the logical break-point for candian cross that already works.
# 00:27:49 bhundven well, that one's hard for me to test
# 00:29:04 mingwandroid yeah, we need to get a sensible test going ASAP.
# 00:29:15 bhundven ok
# 00:29:18 mingwandroid If I fix mingw-w64 as a priority?
# 00:29:25 mingwandroid or else something like you can do linux arm -> linux x86 -> ?
# 00:29:29 mingwandroid not sure what ? is yet
# 00:29:55 mingwandroid a guy has been working hard to fix Wine so that it works well for Cygwin and MSYS2.
# 00:30:00 mingwandroid he's very nearly there now.
# 00:30:18 mingwandroid he's upstreamed fixes all over the place, Cygwin + Wine
# 00:30:48 bhundven hrm
# 00:31:11 mingwandroid https://github.com/fracting/wine-fracting/wiki/MSYS2-on-Wine
# 00:31:12 bhundven ubuntu 15.10 has wine-1.6.2
# 00:31:50 bhundven I might have to do that in a vm
# 00:31:59 bhundven I don't want to break my current gamming install :D
# 00:32:08 bhundven *gaming
# 00:32:38 mingwandroid windows install or ..?
# 00:32:55 bhundven ubuntu + wine
# 00:33:12 mingwandroid it'll work on arch .. you gave up on arch didn't you though?
# 00:33:15 bhundven plays some diablo 2 and diablo 3 from time to time.
# 00:33:24 mingwandroid heh, ok
# 00:33:30 bhundven yea, I gave up on arch
# 00:33:38 bhundven the lack of static libs killed it for me
# 00:33:46 mingwandroid yeah, we added them back on MSYS2.
# 00:34:02 mingwandroid thing is, autotools doesn't really support them, nor does CMake.
# 00:34:10 mingwandroid and OS X doesn't either anymore.
# 00:34:15 mingwandroid the world is changed.
# 00:35:24 mingwandroid but I don't like it either, let the user decide.
# 00:35:27 bhundven well, osx can: https://opensource.apple.com/tarballs/Csu/
# 00:35:48 bhundven arch linux, is a bit more complicated, imho
# 00:36:10 mingwandroid sure, but it's made tricky https://developer.apple.com/library/mac/qa/qa1118/_index.html
# 00:36:21 mingwandroid "Obviously, we won't support such an endeavor"
# 00:37:00 bhundven bleh
# 00:38:20 mingwandroid on this topic, I've got a small build system templates project on github that I don't find enough time to hack on.
# 00:38:45 bhundven oh?
# 00:39:02 mingwandroid where I try to work out how to do all these sorts of things on every build system I care about. I never could figure out how to get autotools to link to a static library if a shared library was also present
# 00:39:19 mingwandroid https://github.com/mingwandroid/build-system-templates
# 00:39:37 mingwandroid yeah.
# 00:39:48 bhundven ah, I think I looked at this
# 00:41:34 mingwandroid probably! And I likely didn't do any more since. Actually, I'd like to ask experts on each system to help me out, since they'll know better than I.
# 00:42:26 bhundven I actually spent a few days looking at replacing ct-ng's autotools with cmake
# 00:42:40 mingwandroid a python developer asked us how to do it on MSYS2, and my only useful advice to him was "delete the shared libraries" which is what finally worked.
# 00:43:06 mingwandroid If we get to adding llvm+clang then cmake will become necessary at some point.
# 00:43:15 mingwandroid which isn't the end of the world.
# 00:43:55 bhundven I'm not really sold on cmake
# 00:44:30 mingwandroid I'm not a fan of any of them. It's stockholm syndrome in code man,.
# 00:44:40 bhundven it becomes more difficult with the kconfig build, and we don't really produce any binaries/libraries (besides kconfig)
# 00:45:05 mingwandroid They hold your code hostage, then for a while you love them, until you see how utterly flawed they are, then you hate them.
# 00:45:14 mingwandroid then you find a new one and the cycle begins again.
# 00:45:25 bhundven well, we have the stockholm syndrome from autotools, but what can we do?
# 00:45:36 bhundven we can replace autotools with perl :P
# 00:45:43 mingwandroid noooo!
# 00:45:46 bhundven endless series of sed/awk scripts
# 00:45:56 mingwandroid m4 vs perl ... fight!
# 00:45:57 bhundven at that point, I'm fine with autotools
# 00:46:15 mingwandroid then again, libtool is perl anyway.
# 00:46:22 bhundven heh
# 00:46:23 mingwandroid autoconf is m4.
# 00:46:32 mingwandroid and lots of shell script.
# 00:46:56 bhundven is lucky to have the experience of running a large sendmail server cluster, and working with m4 -> cf
# 00:47:17 bhundven s/lucky/braindamaged/
# 00:47:37 mingwandroid I think cmake is heading in the right direction, but I don't like the large amount of bespoke C++ code for handling different external libraries like Qt.
# 00:47:58 mingwandroid and that it developed a scripting language after the fact instead of by design.
# 00:48:22 mingwandroid and that cross compilation was added as an after thought too.
# 00:48:28 bhundven isn't that a larry wall'ism?
# 00:48:38 bhundven ...jokingly...
# 00:48:54 mingwandroid oh, is perl a language?
# 00:49:05 bhundven -.-
# 00:49:14 bhundven well, perl6 is
# 00:49:27 bhundven actually designed, instead of evolved
# 00:49:30 mingwandroid I thought perl was a risk factor ;-)
# 00:49:50 bhundven cgi is a risk factor
# 00:50:24 bhundven so many monkeys, so few typewriters...
# 00:50:28 mingwandroid a collection of exploits waiting to happen ;-)
# 00:51:15 bhundven ok, jokes aside, if you can add some non-windows cross-canadian samples to travis, I'll try not to break it when working on 2-pass
# 00:51:59 bhundven that way we know it works before the work on 2-pass, and works after.
# 00:52:49 bhundven then I'll try to get some evening time this weekend to look at cygwin/mingw-w64 PR this weekend, and we'll return monday
# 00:53:19 bhundven really, one sample would be fine
# 00:54:21 mingwandroid let me think. maybe I can fix mingw-w64 this weekend?
# 00:54:51 mingwandroid that may be the easiest actually. fix mingw-w64, then we have availability for linux->mingw->linux candian crosses
# 00:55:41 mingwandroid I can't think of anything useful otherwise is all. unless you think linux->cygwin->linux is good enough?
# 00:57:01 mingwandroid as I say that PR isn't MinGW-w64 at all anymore, purely Cygwin.
# 00:59:14 bhundven ok
# 00:59:41 bhundven idk, x86_64 -> powerpc-e500v2 -> armhf, ?
# 01:00:02 bhundven since I have all three :D
# 01:00:16 bhundven ... on my desk
# 01:01:05 bhundven maybe that will be something I'll work on later, to test my ability to do cross-canadian ;)
# 01:02:09 bhundven mingwandroid: linux->cygwin->linux might be good enough, but the prereq is me reviewing the PR?
# 01:02:29 mingwandroid *maybe* it's late & I'm tired!
# 01:02:42 bhundven I'll do the review on saturday night
# 01:02:46 mingwandroid there's not much in the PR, we can do it quick now and I'll run thru it to describe?
# 01:03:23 mingwandroid I can give you a assessment of any risk in each now real quick?
# 01:03:35 bhundven I'll take a quick look at it later tonight, and comment on it if I have questions.
# 01:04:07 bhundven I'm in the middle of something else
# 01:04:12 mingwandroid ok, add comments and I'll look 1st thing when I get up, and maybe catch you again then.
# 01:04:16 mingwandroid np.
# 01:04:20 mingwandroid I must sleep soon.
# 01:04:20 bhundven ok
# 01:04:40 bhundven sleep... it's good for you :D
# 01:04:50 mingwandroid sure, time for night nurse then.
# 01:05:06 mingwandroid another damn cold, that's about 4 this year :-(
# 01:05:31 mingwandroid right-o, good night, laptop closing.
# 01:10:50 giminy (don't let me interrupt, but I did figure out my --pkg-version issue. Turns out on my debian host build system adds a single quote when appending with +=("--pkg-version=${CT_PKGVERSION}"), while if I append as +=( --pkg-version=${CT_PKGVERSION} ), the quotation insertion doesn't happen)
# 01:11:14 giminy no idea why, but at least I'm humming along tweaking the rest of these ancient libraries
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# 10:08:55 Nazara is it known that the build fails on ncurses: [ERROR] _27042.c:843:22: error: expected ')' before 'int'
# 11:14:10 Nazara okay, it fails on 1.22 as well, what would cause this?
# 11:14:12 Nazara .win 4
# 11:14:17 Nazara ugh
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# 23:05:05 giminy hrmph, stupid newbie question time: the pass-1 gcc compiler is supposed to be without thread support right?
# 23:05:20 y_morin quits : Quit: Nighty Night!

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